My Bullit died after 80 miles - same symptoms you describe. But please don't anyone kid themselves that it's as much of a work out as an analogue bike, if there was no mechanical advantage over analogue what would be the benefit. We bought drive units and crank arms, we are replacing at our cost all damaged parts and are covering labor [and] shipping costs that might occur. There is zero stickiness at the pedals that we could detect. A further TSB that refers to both Shimanos EP8 motor and e*spec ebike cranks also exists on the brands website. Aim for a cadence between 70-90 RPM for maximum efficiency and response from the motor. Both Shimano and e*thirteen recommend that you contact the place of purchase, which will be best-placed to investigate whether the failure is covered under either Shimanos or the bike manufacturers warranty. Regular motor inspections and general servicing should be carried out on the bike as per the manufacturers recommendations to help spot any potential damage before it leads to failure. Don't take things too seriously just get out there and enjoy whatever you own and have FUN! For riders scoping out bigger rides than that, youll want to consider dialling down the Assistance Character to improve efficiency. Come join the discussion about bike parts, components, deals, performance, modifications, classifieds, trails, troubleshooting, maintenance, and more! And you can take the motor together with a battery out in matter of seconds. I don't know anyone that likes a bike that rattles in any way or form. And we certainly wouldnt be upset if Shimano could quieten down the clacking noise. The cheapest Specialized Levo is the Expert model, which sells for just shy of $16K. Hes one of BikeRadars lead testers and knows how to push bikes and products to the limit, searching out the equipment that represents the best value for money. You can't imagine what kind of thought must have gone behind that response? Visit the high-res gallery for more images from this review. Aside from the sound of the clutch, everything else in the "CONS" list can be fixed with software updates. We got in touch with several brands to find out if they knew about the issue, whether they were going to continue to spec the e*thirteen cranks with EP8 motors, and what a customer could expect to happen if they encountered this issue. - Tuning options are simple and effective Put on i9 Hydra hubs, annoying motor rattle sounds disappears. It also responds a fraction quicker at the pedals, and delivers more overrun power when ratcheting the pedals over technical features up a climb. Do you think it could be only an issue with Carbon frames then? I have a gen 3 and it's totally quiet when coasting . Shimanos answers to our questions are published below verbatim. While the increased power certainly grabs most of the headlines, we reckon its the compact form of the Shimano EP8 drive unit that offers the greatest advantage over its competitors. But yeah, different people. Weve ridden the latest Bosch Performance CX Gen 4 motor on a variety of e-MTBs, including the Cube Stereo Hybrid 160 and the Trek Rail. For those playing at home, that works out as a 21% increase over the existing E8000 motor (70 Nm) and a 42% increase over the E7000 motor (60 Nm). Alex Evans is BikeRadars senior mountain bike technical editor. Quick everyone, it's another article about e-bikes grab the pitchforks! In summary, Shimano is aware of EP8 motor spindle failure, and is correlating the issue directly with the installation and use of third-party cranks. Uh oh, another one E-triggered. e*thirteen is at the table with bike brands to find a mutually acceptable solution that first takes care of keeping people on their bikes. And in terms of backup service and support, the fact that there are far more Shimano dealers than there are Specialized dealers may also be preferable for some riders. However, when coasting on rough terrain the unloaded system can exhibit a normal clicking sound that may be detectable to the rider. -- Wild Bill. Good thing with Shimano is warranty,at least here in Madrid is almost instantaneous. Easy fix. Of course this means it also clacks when coasting over rough terrain, though again, weve gotten used to it within a couple of rides. Not a big Chan e but worth a look. Overall very pleased with the bike and the motor. I have ridden ebikes great fun,addictive, you gain some things , but lose some things as well, like all bikes a compromise. That just isn't real world riding though, you just don't spend all your time in boost mode. I tested a few Merida bikes with Shimano motor and they have some bugs in first versions,quite annoying stupid things force you to reset the bike sometimes. Shimano advises that only approved crank arms should be used with its DU-EP8 drive units, reads Shimanos statement. While some frames will resonate more than others, the noise is otherwise normal, and it doesnt take long before your brain subconsciously ignores it. 214 Once paired, find the Customise menu and select Assist. Maximum power output sits at 500W, although the continuous power output is set at 250W like most motors. Only the Levos belt-driven Brose drive unit beats EP8 in terms of motor noise. Were currently testing three bikes with Shimanos EP8 motor and one of those has just over 800km on the odometer. So many issues that can be simply solved by not having a motor. - Numerous battery options, both from Shimano & 3rd parties On the trail the tone of the clack is a little deeper than the EP8 drive unit, but the cause is the same. Quote Start New Topic Post a reply to: SHIMANO EP8 - won't turn on (new bike) It's also a very quiet motor when pedalling. Still, given the lengths that bike and drivetrain manufacturers have gone to stealthify mountain bikes over the past few years, we found the noisy EP8 motor to be infuriating during the first few rides just as we did with the Bosch Gen 4. Sources at numerous ebike suppliers have told Cycle Volta this week that releases of new EP8-equipped electric mountain bikes are being held up, on Shimano's direction. Bikers Edge in Kaysville Utah hooked it up and took a motor off their demo heckler mx and put it on mine. No, not at all. Can I give 100 upvotes please? According to the TSB, only Shimanos EP8 motor is affected. The EM800 display features built-in Bluetooth and ANT+ wireless connectivity for pairing both your phone and a compatible GPS head unit, allowing you to display information such as battery life and remaining range. Let us know what you find out. With that said, all my riding is tough climbs and steep descents, without an e-bike would be walking up a bunch of it. This is because the assistance drops off quite quickly when you stop pedalling, particularly compared to the Bosch motor, which continues to push on for just a fraction longer. The new motor, called EP8, is 10 percent smaller and is a lot lighter. If you are disabled and need a motor on your bike in order to ride, I understand. The metallurgic analysis was conducted to discover root cause. I have to admit some of the comments make me laugh out loud while others score some points for being helpful and based on fact, not hearsay fiction. In a closed Facebook group called Shimano EP8 Owners, there are also reports of EP8 spindle failures. Here in SoCal where everything is hard pack or loose over hard with lots of rocks, the EP8 motor pretty much constantly rattles when you aren't pedaling. Simply enjoy what you are riding and watch the world, I should say, e-bike world, pass you by, as they are here to stay and while they are not perfect they are probably the best and most exciting thing to happen to the bike industry in 50 years! Weve noticed this while pedalling along forest double tracks and on the road to and from the trailhead, but its also apparent when sprinting along faster sections of singletrack. This, of course, is good news for Commencal customers with EP8 drive units and e*thirteen cranks, and were hopeful other brands will follow suit. Does Shimano know why the spindles are snapping? Unfortunately frenchies and Germans are not masters of marketing. I also have Commencal 2021 meta power sx. In comparison, Shimano motors can be paired with third party batteries, and that opens up greater flexibility for bike designers (see the Orbea Rise and Pivot Shuttle for example). Here youll find three sliding scales for each of the three assist modes (thats Eco, Trail and Boost). Bikers Edge in Kaysville Utah hooked it up and took a motor off their demo heckler mx and put it on mine. We have Shimano crank arms in stock, and every customer contacting us from now can get them for free and save some troubles with their spindle, says Commencal. The lighter weight is a big plus as well. - Available on a wide-range of different e-MTBs, - Clacking noise can be annoying
If youve experienced a Shimano EP8 bottom bracket spindle failure, let us know in the comments below. As mentioned earlier, the Bosch motor does feel punchier than Shimano EP8, with noticeably stronger support at lower cadences. However, you do pay for all that refinement and integration. The brand told us it was aware of the spindle issue and has been in contact with both Shimano and e*thirteen about it. Seeing if anyone else out there has had problems with their EP8. Not everyone has the time to grind for an hour up the climb. I had this happen on my Orbea Rise but with different circumstances. How stuff like this gets through what I would like to think was extensive testing I will never know. What is Shimanos take on e*thirteens metallurgic analysis findings? We recommend only Shimano cranks for usage with our drive units. How many instances of this problem has Shimano encountered? - Range estimation is not reliable. As soon as we got the first failures we [started to] spec Shimano [cranks] again but lead time[s] to get the first crank arms [was] quite long so we had some inertia in production. - Lightweight and small form factor I would have respected Shimano more if they owned it and were more forthright about working to resolve it. If in doubt about such components, we recommend speaking to your bicycle manufacturer.. I suppose pedal assist allows you to tackle the more fun/steep/tech climbs but to be effective it needs to be subtle too. That said, wed prefer if there were more metrics displayed on the main screen to begin with, so you could ditch the GPS altogether. "- Only five power bars for charge level.". 2 full laps on the Shore is a good day and have done 3 of those without charging in between (usually in trail mode with boost for a section or two). Regardless ebike or "normal" MTB. However, all are fitted with Shimano cranks. Dank leichter Magnesium-Komponenten konnte Shimano ganze 200 g Gewicht einsparen, was ihn zu einem der leichtesten E-Bike-Motoren auf dem Markt macht. The three EP8 bikes weve tested all have sub-440mm rear centre lengths, which is quite a bit shorter than the 471.5mm rear centre on the Giant Trance X E+ with its much bulkier Yamaha motor, for example. You are not alone. Gear or similar. With the Spectral:ON for example, which has very short chainstays and a relatively slack seat tube angle that puts your weight further over the rear axle on steep climbs, it helped to dial down the Assistance Character (to 6/10), the Maximum Torque (to 78Nm) and the Assistance Start (to 4/5) to soften the bikes power and acceleration. What settings you end up will depend on your personal riding style, and your expectations of range and power output. In comparison, you can get a Polygon Mt Bromo N8 with a Shimano EP8 motor for $7,899 AUD. [The] topic has been closed from Shimano[s] side but e*thirteen is still investigating with independent labs.. Let us know what those are so we can demand them! Updating our software will allow you to change the factory parameters of the new motor from Shimano. If your an RC car guy, imagine the pinion gear not making contact with the spur gear. It doesn't feel good. Start with a full battery, select the Trail mode, and see how far you can go before you run out of juice. - Strong but very well-tuned power delivery What can consumers expect to happen if their EP8s spindle fails? Still, that clutch design means it is impressively drag-free beyond the cutoff point. More powerful:The new Shimano EP8 puts out 85 Nm of torque, 15 Nm more than its predecessor, the Shimano STEPS E8000. The belt-driven design is also a touch quieter when pedalling, and theres no clacking noise either. That Shimano response was pure gold. In comparison, the MasterMind TCU display on the new Specialized Levo offers a significantly more customisable and overall user-friendly experience. To replicate field failures, we had to look outside of the required ISO and EN testing requirements as those tests were passed successfully. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. When youre at those 30-40km/h descending speeds, EP8 doesnt punish you for stamping on the pedals to build some extra speed in the lead-up to a jump or dropoff. According to Shimano, the EP8 motor offers a 36% reduction in drag over the old E8000 motor, and were inclined to believe that claim. What this article says to me is no wonder people make fun of mountain bikers. Despite the musclier performance, weve had excellent results in terms of range, with the Bosch motor regularly achieving more miles and elevation over EP8. Can never hear it over the sound of the wind rushing by or the trail / wheels noises. Essentially, e*thirteen is standing by the findings published in TSB 157, detailed above, and suggests that if a consumer experiences a failure of this nature they should contact their bikes point of sale to get the issue rectified. The Levo SL? I think the only way it can get even close (And still doesn't) to that statement, is riding 25km on an analogue, or 50km on an ebike. there are no additional ports on the SC-E5003 to connect the switch with. Its worth noting that Bosch motor is only compatible with Bosch battery options though. Its a little different though, with Orbea detuning the motors power and assistance to improve efficiency so it can use a smaller and lighter 360Wh battery. We will have them soon available in all our subsidiaries (Canada, USA, Chile, Australia, NZ and Reunion Island) to reach all our customers worldwide.. What's left is just a plain old mountain bike with a weight around 14kg. I'd do way more on a big day. Basically, the battery level drops from around 30% to 2% extremely quickly. Shimano tried to take the Apple approach to antennaegateyou're holding your phone wrongyou're coasting your bike wrong. Sign in to manage your newsletter preferences. After downloading the free E-Tube Project app, youll need to turn the bike on and pair it with your smartphone. It's used on Santa Cruz, Kona, Pivot, Norco, Canyon, Scott, YT, Intense and plenty more. Maximum Torque This allows you to limit the maximum torque, with 10 levels of adjustment from 20 Nm to 85 Nm. As discussed in e*thirteens TSB 157, the cracking and eventual failure of EP8 spindles is something that happens over time through repeated use. oooof! Mine gets very hot. Plus the prices will drop as the tech becomes cheaper and can be offered at lower prices. If youre sprinting at speed, the Levo feels sticky and lazy in comparison to the drag-free EP8 motor. Power delivery is immediately intuitive thanks to the new MasterMind firmware that Specialized developed specifically for the 2.2 motor, which reduces power spikes from rapid changes in crank speed and pedal pressure. The compact size and a magnesium casing helped cut 300 grams. That's it, no recall, but I'm happy to be corrected if I'm wrong. Recalled but still was delivered with the rattle. Maximum power output sits at 500W, although the. I've never heard the rattling noise that has been posted in the early reviews - the motor is super quiet, so it looks to me like much ado about nothing. Get a Polygon Mt Bromo N8 with a battery out in matter of seconds take e! Which sells for just shy of $ 16K 214 Once paired, the... And overall user-friendly experience as those tests were passed successfully you describe must gone. 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End up will depend on your bike in order to ride, i understand an commission.